Injury Horrors: The Brazilian Edition
By: Inara | January 18th, 2008WHY OH WHY????
It’s like every blade of grass is determined to ruin Lyon this season. How else can you explain the fact that Lyon have lost four defensive players to serious, long term knee injuries in the space of six months? FOUR.
First there was Gregory Coupet, immediately followed by Cris, then Patrick Muller, and now Cleber Anderson. FYI, Lyon bought Anderson to cover the absence of Cris.
See ya next season, Cleber.
It’s just not fair.
Anderson picked up his injury after colliding with Tulio de Melo during the Le Mans-Lyon League Cup match last Wednesday. The good news - if it can be called that - is that Anderson’s knee ligaments were only distended, not ruptured, which is often a more serious injury.
So what does this mean for Lyon? Well, right now, Lyon have only Sandy Paillot and Mathieu Bodmer to fill in for Anderson/Cris/Muller. Paillot has yet to play in a Ligue 1 match while Bodmer is a midfielder by trade. Should Sebastien Squillaci pick up an injury or suspension as well, Lyon will be well and truly screwed.
In more bad news, Juninho - in the same game that saw Anderson injured - suffered a fracture on the fifth toe of his left foot. While it’s not that serious, he can’t take part in Sunday’s game against Lens. Which is fine by me. I would rather have him recovered in time for the more important games coming up. To mitigate his absence, Alain Perrin has promised to start Marc Crosas, who will basically be thrown into the deep end (since Bodmer will be playing in defense).
Cris only returned to Lyon yesterday from Brazil. Though he’s not even ready to resume normal training, everyone is hoping that he recovers sooner than expected. That is, in time for the CL knockout rounds. But it’s important to stress that Cris not be rushed back before he is completely healed, or he might suffer a relapse that might be far more serious. To be frank, Lyon can’t place all their hopes on Cris returning in time.
I suppose timing wise, Lyon are a tiny bit fortunate since the transfer window is still open, so they do have time to bring in another defender. But the question is, who? Most of the good ones are either cup tied or beyond our reach in terms of salaries and transfer fees.
And does it make sense to recruit another Anderson-like player? Keep in mind that we also need a defensive midfielder (I mean, just look at the way Jeremy Toulalan is picking up yellow cards…).
An added problem is the fact that Bernard Lacombe and Remy Garde, the two men in charge of recruitment, will be leaving tomorrow for the African Cup of Nations, where they will be looking at players of interest to sign in the summer. It’s not like they can bring someone home from Ghana by January 31st.
But at least Lyon don’t need to worry about bringing in another striker. Fred has decided to stay at Lyon for now (I would make a post about it, but I think I’ll wait until February 1st since he seems to change his mind every other day). And Cris has decided to surrender the captain’s armband back to Juninho, which will keep that issue drama-free.
Honestly, if Lyon can salvage anything out of this season, they deserve an award onto themselves. Now please excuse me while I mail over boxes of horse shoes, rabbits feet, and four leaf clovers over to Alain Perrin.
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Tags: Cleber Anderson, Cris, Gregory Coupet, Jeremy Toulalan, Juninho, Marc Crosas, Mathieu Bodmer, Patrick Muller, Player News and Rumors, Sandy Paillot, Team News and RumorsSubscribe
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Yea right… No french media have linked N’Gog to Lyon. And I take french media over wikipedia. As for Squillaci not being Champions’ League winning quality, you’re right. He’s only good enough to be a finalist.
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Ush: It’s true that Cris messed up on that Totti goal, but if you look at Lyon’s CL records in the past two to three years, Lyon have always had one of the best defenses. Cris is a big part of that (though I still think Squillaci is more efficient). Judging Cris by that goal is like blaming Mexes for the seven MU goals. It just takes their quality out of context.
Also, Lyon did try to bring in Deschamps, but he said the timing was wrong. Lyon needed a coach immediately, and DD had just quit Juventus and wasn’t ready for it. Also, DD wanted to bring his entire staff whereas Lyon insist on having their own continuous staff (Duverne, Bats, Garde, Genesio, etc). But Lyon did try.
And yes, Lyon do have the money, but take a look at last summer for example. Lyon desperately tried to sign both Reyes and Heinze, I mean they tried really hard, yet those two chose to go to La Liga instead. So it’s easy to compete, even for average players.
You are right that the ignoring defense tactic is a bad idea, and I agree with it. I don’t know what Lyon are doing to alleviate their defensive crisis, but they have to do something.
Shazback: Yeah, that’s what I meant - that Lyon want to make sure they are scoring in the second half of the season. At one point last March I think it was, Lyon went six league games without scoring a goal. It was just embarrassing.
Lyon did try to sign Silvestre two years ago, but he turned us down to stay on the bench at MU. Lyon made an effort again last year, but I’m guessing the deal wasn’t attractive enough for him to take a “step down” to L1.
Those good 3rd central defenders who are playing in the EPL probably won’t come. I’m sure Lyon have tried to get a better defender than Anderson (no way the guy was first choice), but for whatever reason, they aren’t coming. People who go to a smaller league from a bigger one, especially coming from bigger clubs, don’t want to take a smaller paycheck and a drop in status to be the third choice on the bench. You have exceptions, like Tiago, but he didn’t care so much about Lyon as he did about his spot on the NT. Baros turned us down the first time and only took us the second time because he was getting booed at Villa. Wiltord came reluctantly as well, after Wenger refused to offer him the extension he wanted. Grosso was sitting on the bench at Inter, off the NT, and insisted on a fat paycheck and a starting position. And umm…that’s pretty much it for Lyon’s recent recruits from bigger leagues than L1. South America is a different matter of course.
I really really hope Lyon can sell Anderson, but who’s going to take him?
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Yer sell Anderson but the amount wed get for him wouldnt even be worth it, who would want to buy him anyway. Maybe Metz or someone like that. Shazback, Squillaci is not at all champs league finalist quality, however i accept your nievety towards the champions league considering Rennes havent and wont be init any time soon. Oh and Lyomn couldnt have tried that hard to get heinze and reyes otherwise theyd be here, to footballers money is everything. If it was a choice between Barca and Istres for a player but Istres offered double they pay pack, Im sure the player would sign for Istres.
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Is and has been (a finalist)…
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Ronan, if that were true, all the good players would be playing in Qatar.
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Well how come players are attracted to clubs such as tottenham,Shakhtar,monaco and atletico Mdrid, these clubs are offering money more than the top sides and the players are being lured. ( especially shakhtar ). Squillaci was a minor part of a previous final campaign, which was completely out of the blue, its not like he was playing for Inter. Lyon always have excuses for transfers ( or lack of them ) anyway. Thats wot pisses me off, if wed done the correct business just replacing departing players with better ones which is standard for most clubs then the champs league wud be realistic. I really wud like Lyon to sign De melo despite the turmoil involved with speculation involving his departure to italy.
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Ronan… You know Squillaci has already played a Champions’ League final, right? He played part of the Monaco - Porto final in the 2004 UEFA Champions’ League final in AufShalke Arena…
As for “money being the root of all footballers’ transfers”, that’s simply not true… Even if Istres did offer a double pay check than Barça, I’m sure the player would choose Barça. There are a few counter-examples, such as Zarate, but even they don’t last long… Zarate has taken a wage cut to come to England, and a lot of footballers prefer to stay in/move to Europe rather than go play in the MLS, the Q-League, the J-League or in the Russian and Ukrainian league, even if their salary is smaller. Money can buy some things, but even MasterCard can’t buy everything.
(A famous example of “money not buying everything” is Ole Gunnar Solskjaer’s decision to stay at Manchester United in 1998, when Tottenham Hotspurs had offered him almost the double in salary, as well as a starting role… But he preferred to stick to the bench at Man U, and ended up scoring a winning goal in the Nou Camp, UEFA Champions’ League class of ‘99.)
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Since Ronan answered whilst I was typing my answer, I didn’t see his post at 1:21 pm on January 19th, 2008 when writing my post at 1:26 pm.
The players that are attracted to Shaktar or Monaco aren’t the same type of players that Lyon could attract, nor wants to attract. Shakhtar has how many players that you’d like to see playing for Lyon? Honestly? Hübschmann? Chygrynski? Srna? And that’s about it, I think. Lyon are far ahead of them, and it’s obvious when looking at the transfers Shakhtar has been part of this season : Nery Castillo leaving after 6 months because he’s made his way out of obscurity thanks to the Copa America, Lucarelli joining for 6 months because his club needed the money before returning to Parma! They’re far smaller than Lyon in terms of squad quality, depth and buying capacity. Let’s not forget that Lyon splashed 18M€ on Keita, attracted a World Cup winner, and only really sold to “very big” clubs : Barcelona, Juventus and Chelsea. Not like Shakhtar who sold to Zaragossa, Bochum and Stuttgart… And those were their best players back then! Lyon doesn’t want to attract the same type of players as Monaco can either. Monaco has since a long time been a great place for two things : players to try to get their careers back on track (Morientes is the most famous) and is advantaged by it’s particular fiscal régime to attract “stars” such as Klismann, Marquez… Lyon doesn’t have this fiscal régime, and can’t compete in terms of salary. So it’s down to reputation. And there, Monaco wins. Because they were twice finalists in european competitions and have a foot-long list of heroes of international football : Weah, Barthez, Milla, Bierhoff, Hoddle…
The case with Tottenham and Atletico is that they’re both clubs that are more prestigious than Lyon. Tottenham might only be in the UEFA Cup, but they’re up against the “big 3″, and the North London Derby is one of the best-known derbies in the world. Atletico are also part of one of the biggest football rivalries, and are very, very well known in south america for it. Both clubs have also had their hour(s) of glory in europe, Tottenham sporting more cups than the whole armada of French Clubs (2 UEFA + 1 Cup Winner’s) whilst Atletico has a Cup Winner’s to brag about.
So yes, for an even salary, I think any footballer would choose Tottenham or Atletico. If they were offered a better salary, they might consider Lyon and Monaco. But for Shaktar, it’s a much bigger salary before it starts to enter the picture. So that’s why players like Reyes accept a salary that’s lower than the one Lyon would offer him to sit on the bench at Real Madrid. Because it’s Real Madrid.
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Well first of all Shazback i mentioned about Squillaci playing in a previous final, but its not like he was playing for a club who were odds on to win the CL anyway, it was a lucky and unpredictable campaign which he didnt play a big part in, otherwise do u really think Monaco would want to swap monsoreau for him ? Squillaci is not a player who would get int a side like real madrid,barca,Man u or Inter Milan would he which tells me hes not CL winning quality, especially the penaltys and mistakes hes made this season, i say cash in a few bob on him and get some one who is on real proven form. Secondly regards the money situation im not convinced by wot u said. The players u named zarate- untill recently i didnt have a clue who he was, so thats not a worth while example and solsjaer, that happened over ten years ago- ur clutching at straws. Any way Lyon arent a highly prestigious club so we cant attract players on low salaries( ur idea ). Seeing as lyon usually shop in the pound shop and primark for players, De melo wud be rather chap and a good talent,no ?
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Chap- i ment cheap
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Shazback, i appreciate ur comments but why do players care about a clubs history about 20-30 years ago, and derbys why wud u move to a club for 1 or 2 derbys, and previous players who thyll never meet let alone play with? The players Lyon brought as u said “grosso” and “keita”. Grosso- wrong side of thirty, cheap transfer fee and a poor,poor season the latter plus Inter were keen to get rid of him anyway, as well as the fact that he replaced a departure who was much better than him (grosso for abidal ). Keita, he played for Lille, a club edgeing towards relegation from ligue 1 now and again replaced a player who he will never truly replace.
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Oh and for the record there are a few nplayers id like to see at lyon rather than shakhtar-
hladky
lucarelli
brandao
fernandinho
castillo
srna
ilsinho
jadson
chygrinskiySo yer if lyon werre offered these players i certantly wouldnt say no.
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De Melo has already signed a pre-contract with Palermo. He’s not availible any more.
Sure, Monaco weren’t seen as potential winners before the competition. But then again, nor was Porto. However, Squillaci started in 8 of Monaco’s 13 games, and was a sub in the final. So yes, he did play less than Givet and Rodriguez (13 starts both), but he wasn’t some kind of strange cameo in the final. Monsoreau was just exchange money. Squillaci wanted out, and Monaco wanted a player to come in to replace him. They thought Monsoreau would fit the bill. He didn’t. Squillaci still cost 3M€ though, as well as Monsoreau.
Squillaci wouldn’t get into Barça/Inter? I’m not so sure… After all, Abidal was overlooked for a long time as a good defender when he was at Lyon, Evra was overlooked as a good defender when he was at Monaco, there have been a whole lot of players who’s level is deceptive… So Squillaci could very well be able to get Marquez/Milito’s place at Barça or Maicon/Samuel’s at Inter.
Well, you can have the right to “not be convinced” by what I said, but can you find a situation of a player who turned down Man U/Milan/Real/Barça/Arsenal/Juventus for a bigger contract in a smaller club? I can’t. Except for Zarate. And he’s just forfeited all this reasoning by moving to Europe now that he’s sure his parents have enough money to live well. And he took a pay cut in the process. Your plead of “non-stardom” is a double-edged sword : no players outside the “big” clubs or the “big” leagues are known. Who knows the starting midfield of FF Jaro? Who cares about the “star” striker of FC Mglebi Zugdidi? Nobody. So even if he gets a salary that’s double by staying there, a footballer can’t resist trying his chance in a “big” league. Because he knows that having played is a “big” league, he’ll be a bigger star back home than he could ever have been in his home league. I was surprised to find out that the Norwegan, Swedish and Danish media cover quite intensely their “nationals” that play even in lesser foreign clubs : Kahlenberg or Rommedahl get as much media cover as home stars such as Helveg! So yes, for a young danish star, it’s interesting to get a big pay each month. But it’s “just” as important to “succede” in a “big” league, and ultimately play for a “big” club.
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No squillaci definately wouldnt get into a top 8 european club, plus you say 3 mill as if its a big fee, its nothing for a champs league club to spend on a player considering the small value of monsoreau. i also would say he was unlucky not to start ahead of rodriguez and givet, their 2 slow donkeys IMO who lack positioning skills, any way footballs moved on this was almost four years ago now, my general argument is that lyon need to buy players. I hate i mean loath the way lyon are actually prepared t play two midfielders in defencive positions, that is tite and stupid.
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“hladky - lucarelli - brandao - fernandinho - castillo - srna - ilsinho - jadson - chygrinskiy”
Lucarelli and Castillo have already left. As for the rest, I’ll leave you with a short video to admire their qualities in europe : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2LZrMWQg9rk
Yes. That’s a 1-0 loss against SALTZBURG. This year. They seemed completely unable to score, whilst their defence was so friable that Salzburg were unlucky to not score 3.
Not convinced yet? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bF_V2Q8jEl4
Yep. The 2-1 loss to Benfica. Admire Cardozo’s first goal, curtesy a lovely ball by Chygrinsky. Honestly. Who on that side would make the cut for a Lyon side that’s “too good” for Squillaci?
Or even better : Milan’s demolition of the Miners : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dzYq4eoNDeg
They have no midfield, no defence… The attack was slightly better, but with Castillo and Lucarelli that have left, there’s nothing good there anymore.Honestly, there’s nothing at Shakhtar that Lyon should be jealous of. In attack, Benzema and Fred are a clut above the list of brazilian second choice players you listed. In midfield, Källström, Toulalan, Bodmer, Ben Arfa, Juninho and Govou are more than a match for them, and Keita/Delgado/Crosas/Fabio Santos aren’t even in the picture. Coupet wouldn’t even be worried by being in competition with their goalkeepers now that Lastuvka has left. In defence, their uselessness makes Anderson look like a good defender…
You say Grosso is the “wrong side of 30″… Well, so is Lucarelli. And yet you say you’d want him. So how do I solve that one? Unless you’re going to postulate that Lucarelli is better than Benzema, but then I don’t see the point in going on, because anything is possible in such a world. Keita was (with Bodmer) scouted by Milan AC, Manchester United, Liverpool and other “big” clubs. They didn’t make the move because they felt he wasn’t good enough, but it’s those two players who kept Lille a Champion’s League club last season. They left, and the club that beat AC Milan has fallen to 17th in the league. That’s testament to how important they were. And as for the player he “replaced”, I must admit I’m at a loss… Keita didn’t replace anybody. He is a right winger. No right wingers left Lyon last summer. Nor the summer before. If you’re talking about Malouda, then you’ve got your wings mixed up. And honestly, he’s not that good either. He’s enjoying Chelsea’s bench, but that’s it.
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“I hate i mean loath the way lyon are actually prepared t play two midfielders in defencive positions, that is tite and stupid.”
AC Milan 2006/07 : Gattuso - Pirlo - Seedorf : I detect 3 midfielders in defensive positions, and no wingers.
Real Madrid 2006/07 : Diarra - Emerson : I see two defensive midfielders!
Barcelona’s trio of Xavi-Iniesta-Deco/Touré can be described as defensive seen how low they play on the field.
Liverpool, Chelsea, Juventus, Inter… teams that field two defensively-minded midfielders are commonplace. In fact, it happens almost as soon as a team switches from 4-4-2 to 4-5-1 or 4-2-3-1 or 4-4-1-1…
As for “why do players care about what happened 20-30 years ago and old players they’ll never play with”, well I reverse once more the question : why do Quatari clubs (who offer amongst the best salaries in the world) find it hard to attract players? QED.
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your just wasting time and energy Shazback, its not like Ronan is going to listen your argument. All he’s gonna do is dismiss your excellent points……move on Lyon’s defensive problems…….suggest more players that are cup tied for us to buy……and criticize lyon for selling good players ( who wanted to leave ).
arent you Mr. Don ? lol
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Good lord, how can you criticize the only man who is holding our backline together, Toto Squillaci. Anderson’s injury is unfortunate, but to be honest, he does more good to us not playing then anything. Bodmer will get his playing time in now, with Paillot picking up some experience. Buying a center back sounds silly to me right now though, as with Cris returning and Anderson not out for the season it seems hasty. Plus Muller will return next year. We may have to many center backs when all is said and done. A loan wouldnt be a bad move, but who could we get on loan who could play CL football?
Also, why start Crosas? Perrin wants to use the 4-4-2 so bad, he does.
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The center back loan is not an invitation for Ronan to list players he thinks are mediocre…
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Shazback-Those clubs never play those players in that position unless theres an emergency for 1-2 games but they are replaced streight away anyway, uve got that wrong the clubs defenders u mentioned are 2nd 2 1 defenders as well. Plus the Shakhtar players i would have if i were OFFERED them. Are u saying if Rennes were offered Brandao u wud say no ? Players dont want to got to quatar becoz its bloody quatar-i wouldnt want to go there, do u really want me to list target defenders ?
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Yer but who cares how Anderson or muller feel about anything, there crap get them out ASAP. Bodmer doesnt want to be played in a position he is dodgy at which isnt his. Why is it are good players wanted to leave, ask urself, coz lyon wernt prepared to spend $.
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heitinga
barzagli
mathijsen
demichellisYou asked
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I’m not going to go on after this, because it’s getting ridiculous. Ronan : Milan, Juventus, Liverpool, Real, Chelsea, and sometimes Inter and Barcelona play with 2 defensive midfielders. Regardless of injuries. They win stuff. So yes, clubs like Arsenal, Manchester and Roma are nicer to watch because they only have one defensive midfielder, but Lyon has to do what it can. And if to win Lyon has to put 2 defensive midfielders on the pitch, I don’t see where the problem is.
As for the Shakhtar players being offered to Lyon… Again. Who would Lyon take? Even on a free transfer, I can only see three potential transfer targets : Hübschmann, Chygrynski and Srna. And even then, they’d only be bench players, so they’d have to be on small salaries. As I see it, there isn’t a single player in Shakhtar that would get onto a Lyon squad that doesn’t have any injuries. So yes, there would be a few that would do it for Rennes, and Hübschmann, Chygrynski and Srna (as well as Hladky and Fernandinho) would be nice transfers for Rennes. But only for Rennes, a club that has been knocked out of the UEFA Cup without a win in the group stage. There’s a world between Rennes and Lyon, mate. (As for Brandao, Rennes have got Briand, who’s pretty much the same player, with ball control.)
I don’t see what you hold against Qatar… Honestly, it’s far better than Brazil or eastern Europe. It’s a country where footballers are very well paid, get a lot of public attention (each club is run by a cheik), there’s not much crime, so the only “problem” you could have is the strong presence of Islam. But christian players have never found it bothersome, since as they’re “foreigners” and footballers, they’re given more leeway. Now go on and list target defenders. And just try to get some that are better than Chygrynski, because although I’d like Lyon to sign a donkey like him, so that he’d allow Briand a few chances on goal the next time Rennes face Lyon, I doubt Lyon will bid for him.
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Yer thanx shazback, wot do you make of heitinga,barzagli,mathijen and demichellis. (especially Demichellis as hes CB AND DM and wud link well with delgado and other south americans ) Quatar is a islam club, im a chatholic so that wud be a problem for me. Dont knock Shakhtar there a decent outfit and i like a few of there players here, if given the chance. Dont forget they were so unlucky not to qualify from a tough group stage in CL. Lyon in my opinion have to many crapy players in the squad e.g- Anderson,muller,reveillere,santos,paillot,beynie,vercoutre and possibly Baros who should and need to be replaced for Lyon to be a european force, coz at the moment my moneys on Man u to get thru comfortably. Thanks for constantly answering me i appreciate it Shazback.
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yeah whatever
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